Egypt and Middle-East protests - your views.

[i_like_1981]

Now, I'm sure that you've all been hearing about these mass protests and demonstrations that have been going on in Egypt, to try and overthrow the president who has been in power since... 1981. I was just wondering what you were all thinking. Do you think he should step down in order to appease the masses that are so desperate for his immediate resignation, or do you think that he should stay in power until the next presidential elections are organised but try to make a bold, meaningful effort to introduce real reforms in his country that may just manage to quell some of his opponents. Furthermore, what do you think is actually going to happen? Personally, I'm doubting that he's going to last until September, because the demonstrators are really cranking up the pressure on him and showing him that his days of total dominion are over. I think that, although he remains resistant now, eventually he will buckle under pressure. But we'll see about that.

Best regards,
i_like_1981

[Earl]

I'm quite apprehensive about these latest developments in Egypt, but I've absolutely no idea what should be done about it. Even if the current regime seeks to defuse the opposition by enacting sweeping reforms, I'm afraid that the eventual result will not be a democratic government that poses no threat to its neighbors (or, for that matter, to the religious minority in that country who have been and continue to be persecuted by "militant" Muslims), but another Islamic Republic just like Iran since 1979. In other words, a complete disaster. In my opinion, such an Islamofascist regime would not abide by the current peace treaty with Israel, but most likely would break it. Such a regime would pose an ominous threat to peace (what little there is) in the Middle East. Which would mean bad news, of course, to us in the West (not to mention Israel). The United States cannot afford, financially and otherwise, to get into another war; and I'm sure, i_like_1981, your country cannot afford to do so either. Scary situation.

[i_like_1981]

Yes, I am also quite apprehensive as to what will happen when (I don't say if, because I'm sure it's going to happen) Mubarak is ousted from his position. There is no definite successor to the presidency as of now. There is that man ElBaradei, who is becoming somewhat of a figurehead for the opposition against the Egyptian president, but I've been hearing rumours that he ain't extremely popular as the newspapers point out. If Mubarak is ousted and there has been no successor allocated, there is going to be even more conflict for that top seat and someone is eventually going to take it by means of brutal force. I'll be keeping an eye on this in the news.

Best regards,
i_like_1981

[Lewis]

I support the protests, the best thing to come out of this is Mubarak announcing he will step down. Hopefully the moderates will ensure stability in Egypt.

[i_like_1981]

I support the protests, the best thing to come out of this is Mubarak announcing he will step down. Hopefully the moderates will ensure stability in Egypt.

I strongly doubt that Mubarak's announcement that he will step down at the next elections is going to be enough to bring these protests to an end. It looks like the protesters will accept nothing more than his immediate resignation, which I expect he will be forced to give before much longer. However, I can't be fully sure that the rulers who succeed him will be the democratic moderates everybody is hoping for. It is in these sorts of situations in which revolutions happen and more extremists manipulate the situation.

Best regards,
i_like_1981

[i_like_1981]

Well, I've heard the news - tonight could well be the night that Mubarak steps down. I hear he'll be making the televised speech at 8pm GMT - that's 10 minutes from now. Who knows what will happen. If he does step down, I'll post an article here in my thread. I'm surprised this topic hasn't drawn more responses - history is being made right now, like it was back in 1989 when Communism fell in Europe.

Best regards,
i_like_1981

[Lewis]

Egypt's Mubarak resigns as leader

Hosni Mubarak has decided to step down as president of Egypt.

In an announcement on state TV, Vice-President Omar Suleiman said Mr Mubarak had handed power to the military.

It came as thousands massed in Cairo and other Egyptian cities for an 18th day of protest to demand Mr Mubarak's resignation.

Protesters responded by cheering, waving flags, embracing and sounding car horns. "The people have brought down the regime," they chanted.

Mr Suleiman said Mr Mubarak had handed power to the high command of the armed forces.

"In the name of God the merciful, the compassionate, citizens, during these very difficult circumstances Egypt is going through, President Hosni Mubarak has decided to step down from the office of president of the republic and has charged the high council of the armed forces to administer the affairs of the country," he said.

"May God help everybody."

Mr Mubarak has already left Cairo and is in the Red Sea resort of Sharm el-Sheikh where he has a residence, officials say.

In Cairo, thousands of people are gathered outside the presidential palace, in Tahrir Square and at state TV.

They came out in anger following an address by Mr Mubarak on Thursday. He had been expected to announce his resgination but instead stopped short of stepping down, transferring most powers to Mr Suleiman.

The BBC's Jon Leyne in Cairo said the announcement caught everyone by surprise, and all over the city drivers honked their horns and people fired guns into the air.

But the army takeover looks very much like a military coup, our correspondent adds.

The constitution has been breached, he says, because officially it should be the speaker of parliament who takes over, not the army leadership.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-12433045

I'm glad Mubarak's gone, but I do worry the army will seize power. It appears the domino effect is in action.

[i_like_1981]

Yep, I heard about that earlier. It looks like the people have won in the end - Mubarak is now gone. But who knows what'll come next? The tension was kept alive for me when I heard that the army were now in charge. Let's hope this does not descend into a military coup or another extremist comes to power. Anyways, I always had my doubts that Mubarak would last until September, and now I know for sure. The will of the people has prevailed on this day.

Best regards,
i_like_1981

[HugeFanOfBadReligion]

Yeah, I heard that he resigned in civics class today, shortly after the news was released. Personally, I don't really know what to think of the situation and I haven't really had any major opinions on it since the situation began. But in general, I was hoping he would resign, however this military takeover doesn't sound good at all to me.

[ChrisOH]

It's definitely a "wait and see" situation -- overthrowing an authoritarian or unpopular leader doesn't always lead to democratic (or even stable) governments. See Castro in Cuba, the Taliban in Afghanistan, Milosevic in Yugoslavia and all the Balkan wars that resulted from the fall of Communism, and the Shiite/Sunni/Kurd mess in Iraq after Saddam Hussein was deposed, for just a few examples. Hopefully the Egyptian people will be a vigilant as they are jubilant.

[Lewis]

Well the revolution has spilled over to Libya, it looks like the dominos are falling. I hope Gaddafi is ousted.

[i_like_1981]

Well the revolution has spilled over to Libya, it looks like the dominos are falling. I hope Gaddafi is ousted.

It's absolutely astounding, isn't it, how long some of these leaders have been in power for. Gaddafi has been in power since 1969 - that's 12 years more than I've been alive. No wonder people are so desperate for a change. It's a liberty, isn't it, how people complain so much about the leadership we have here in Britain when many countries across the world don't even allow their people to have any say in the matter and govern them with an iron fist, allowing no dissent. The next time the people in our country manage to enjoy the chance to publicly insult their leaders without fearing retributions, they should think how lucky they are. I am following the Libyan protests with a curious eye.

Best regards,
i_like_1981

[recovering_fan]

It's definitely a "wait and see" situation -- overthrowing an authoritarian or unpopular leader doesn't always lead to democratic (or even stable) governments.

Don't leave out Khomeini and Iran!

My worry is that these countries that are now liberating themselves have no intuitive sense of how to manage themselves as democracies, whereas they probably have a more concrete idea of how to proceed as theocracies.

Fun and games ahead...

[ChrisOH]

Don't leave out Khomeini and Iran!

Yes, another good example of overthrowing an autocratic ruler only to replace him with someone worse. Under the Shah, Iran became modernized and much like American society in many ways. Khomeini's revolution seemed to only turn them into a theocracy and put them at odds with the rest of the civilized world.

I've always believed, though, that you can't force democracy on people, they have to want it. Some years ago, I had a female keypal from Kuwait who told me that she was an atheist, didn't believe in Allah and all of the formalities of the Islamic culture, etc., but she didn't make it public, as, although Kuwait is moderate in many ways, her family still followed the traditional ways and she didn't want to risk any repercussions or shame on them. She said many of the older women in Kuwait still wore the veils, full body coverings, etc., and were subservient to their husbands, because that was what they knew and were comfortable with.

Change (even if it's "good" change) doesn't come easy to a great many people.

[Indurrago]

My worry is that these countries that are now liberating themselves have no intuitive sense of how to manage themselves as democracies, whereas they probably have a more concrete idea of how to proceed as theocracies.

Fun and games ahead...

This was my major concern about these protests if they succeeded the big question would be "Now what?" If they fail to establish a working democracy I wouldn't be surprised if they just have another revolution that changes back to the way it was.