Here to have a civilized debate.

[Andy]

Many may have seen my posts in the guestbook, and if you haven't I will tell you what I'm about. My name is Andy, I play college football and have 3.5 GPA in my major that is nursing. I am not here to tell you that you must love sports, because you are entitled to your opinion. I'm here to tell you not to believe all of the sports stereotypes. I love sports and will continue to love sports even after my career is finished. I do not plan to play professional football, I hope to travel the world after I earn my degree and help those in 3rd world countries that cannot help themselves.

I'm here to give an athletes point of view so please ask me any questions you want, just try to keep it civilized and keep bashing to a minimum.

[Sergey]

Hai! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sf7RTWpj ... re=related

[Tony]

Yes, Andy and I have been trying to have a civilized debate with people on the guestbook about them stereotyping us athletes (I start WR/PR in football and Small Forward in basketball). We are here to say that all of those stories about athletes being intollerant assholes are wrong.

[Fat Man]

Many may have seen my posts in the guestbook, and if you haven't I will tell you what I'm about. My name is Andy, I play college football and have 3.5 GPA in my major that is nursing. I am not here to tell you that you must love sports, because you are entitled to your opinion. I'm here to tell you not to believe all of the sports stereotypes. I love sports and will continue to love sports even after my career is finished. I do not plan to play professional football, I hope to travel the world after I earn my degree and help those in 3rd world countries that cannot help themselves.

I'm here to give an athletes point of view so please ask me any questions you want, just try to keep it civilized and keep bashing to a minimum.

Good evening Andy.

You seem like a reasonable and intelligent guy judging from your message above.

It's good that your planning a career in nursing. I wish more athletes were like you, to set a good example for your fellow team mates.

Unfortunately most are not.

Yes, Andy and I have been trying to have a civilized debate with people on the guestbook about them stereotyping us athletes (I start WR/PR in football and Small Forward in basketball). We are here to say that all of those stories about athletes being intollerant assholes are wrong.

Excuse me, but NOT ALL the stories about athletes being intolerant assholes are wrong.

Granted, there are some athletes who are not intolerant assholes, but not all of the stories are wrong.

I should know from personal experiences.

First time I was ever suspended from school was in the 4th grade because I failed to climb a rope in a gymnasium. Never mind that I was making good grades in all of my academic subjects, and never mind that the reason for my being unable to climb the rope was because of a cripple up left knee which was the result of a car accident at the age of 4 years.

Because of injured left knee, I was not able to run like most of the other kids in my school, and I walked with a limp. And now, even though I'm a fat man, I wasn't fat yet when I was in grade school. I didn't become really overweight until my teenage years.

Anyway, my PE instructor was an intolerant asshole, else he would not have had me suspended from school just for failing to climb a stupid rope in the gym.

I guess, in our schools, athletics is more important than academics.

My 5th grade teacher was also really Gung Ho when it came to PE. He liked to humiliate me in front of the other students in the gym. One day, we were playing basketball, and during the game the ball slipped out of my hands. My teacher grabbed the ball and punched in the stomach with it as hard as he could, and it felt like forever before I could catch my breath again.

Then there was another time when our 5th grade class went to the library. All the other kids in my class were allowed to check out any book they wanted, but I wasn't.

There was this one Astronomy book that I wanted, but my teacher would not allow me to check out the book. We got into an argument and he dragged me out into the hallway then he grabbed me by the shoulders, pushed me backwards against the wall, bashing me head against the corner of the concrete block wall. I suffered a conclusion to my head as a result. I was 11 years old at the time, and for some years afterward, during my teenage years, I had headaches and dizzy spells that gradually became less severe as I got older.

The following year, that teacher was fired and could not get a teaching job anywhere else. But for me, the damage was already done.

He was an intolerant asshole.

I was only in the 3rd grade when I was reading at the adult level, because my mother had taught me how to read and write before I even started going to school.

Now, forward some more years.

When I was in high school, back in 1969 at the age of 17 years, my science teacher was also the schools football coach, so during football season, he was too damn busy coaching his team of pre-frontally lobotomized baboons to be teaching in the science class. Instead, he would set up a movie projector and go out of the classroom, leaving us to sit in the dark watching stupid cartoons.

I wanted to learn science damn it!

So, my teacher, who was also coach, was another intolerant asshole!

In school, I was the typical nerd or geek. I didn't care for sports, and I was often harassed by the jocks in my school.

Sorry Jimbo, but many (yeah, granted, not all) but many athletes and coaches I have known were intolerant assholes.

So, NOT ALL the stories about athletes being intolerant assholes are wrong.

And you can take that to the fucking bank!!!

[Earl]

Hi, Andy. Hi, Tony. Welcome to the three-ring circus. (Just a little levity, folks.) And thank you for your patience and forbearance, by the way. Once again, I find myself in the position of being between two camps representing different points of view. The fact that there are decent guys in both camps makes the situation a little complicated. Itâ??s so much easier when your critic is abusive. I hope that Iâ??ll do a better job of promoting a discussion than I have in the recent past. We should all relate to each other as individuals, not simply as members of a group. And we should not get personal with each other over our differences (perceived or otherwise).

That being said, Iâ??ll start off by saying that our views are colored by different personal experiences. Unless we have reason to be suspicious, we should assume that the other person is telling the truth. When there are differences, we should try to figure out what accounts for those differences. I hope I havenâ??t just spouted a bunch of BS. Itâ??s late and my thoughts are not clear.

A common accusation made against this website by those who are abusive is that weâ??re just jealous of athletes. That claim can be easily disproved by pointing out that none of us here ever had any interest in sports or any desire to participate in them. So, there is no reason why we would be jealous.

The problem is that some of us, such as Fat Man and i_like_1981, had bitter experiences in their formative and teenage years with bullying (much of it physical) by individual athlete classmates. (Notice I used the word â??individualâ? here. Iâ??m not meaning to make a negative stereotype.) I say this not to necessarily make a particular point at this time, but simply to provide a little understanding why some of us react the way we do. It should also be pointed out that Andy once got into a fight with a bully to make him stop harassing other students at his school. Credit should be given where credit is due, and we should recognize the validity of each otherâ??s experiences. (Again, I hope Iâ??m not just spouting BS. Iâ??m really tired.)

Hopefully, I may have provided a starting point for discussion. Iâ??m just trying to initiate an exchange. I really want this forum to work. Letâ??s try to actually learn something. No one should feel that his ego is at stake here. And I may have questions of my own to ask later.

[SPORTS ROCK.]

Yes, Andy and I have been trying to have a civilized debate with people on the guestbook about them stereotyping us athletes (I start WR/PR in football and Small Forward in basketball). We are here to say that all of those stories about athletes being intollerant assholes are wrong.

why are you trying to reason with that idiot sergey? all he can do is swear and go mad at people. I think he is jealous of you. Jealous that you can get girls and he cant because no woman wants a geek who just sits playing world of warcraft all day. the only emotion u should have for him is pity...

[Fat Man]

Yes, Andy and I have been trying to have a civilized debate with people on the guestbook about them stereotyping us athletes (I start WR/PR in football and Small Forward in basketball). We are here to say that all of those stories about athletes being intollerant assholes are wrong.

why are you trying to reason with that idiot sergey? all he can do is swear and go mad at people. I think he is jealous of you. Jealous that you can get girls and he cant because no woman wants a geek who just sits playing world of warcraft all day. the only emotion u should have for him is pity...

And I suppose you're setting a fine example for having a civilized debate?

You seriously need to put a sock in it!!!

The only kind of gal you can get is some redneck bucktoothed trailer-trash slut who buys cheap Walmart perfume by the gallon!

Most likely, you have a preference for barnyard animals!

Hey! How do you circumcise a redneck?

Kick his sister in the jaw!

So, look who's talking Jimbo Bubbah Booey!!!

[Tony]

FatMan, I am sorry for the trama you were caused. I understand that coaches are complete dicks. My 7th grade B-ball coach was always telling me to be physical and box-out. I was pretty scrawny when I was 13.. I got some muscle and played tougher and boxed out way better. He is still an asshole to me.. always telling me something I need to improve on. I just began to ingnore him and we I started, I became the basketball player I am today. I see why you hate sport fans... especially coaches (that's a common thing for students). Every coach is a bad coach until you get to college where they only hire quality coaches. I also disapprove of coaches being teachers (or vice versa). It always distracts them from teaching and one of the strugglers in my class eventually failed Algebra because the baseball coach was busy dreaming of what would have happened if the team won last Saturday or Sunday. Teachers are teachers... highschools should get a stationary coach that only deals with athletics. I see that your teachers/coaches caused you very much trama, and one even gave you a head problem. It sickens me that HS coaches are like that.. another reason why they should have NOTHING to do with academics... if this attitude keeps up, I say that schools raise the minimum GPA (too play sports) from somewhere around a C to a B... it will not only force athletes too become more intelligent, but it will also help them focus on school a bit more.


But also, not ALL of them are wrong.. but many... I'm not saying that all athletes are like Andy and I, but they are not ALL intollerant assholes... out of the 100 million athletes I would guess less than 2k of them are intollerant assholes.. most of them are decent people... and then the rest are top of the class intelligent like Andy and I.

[Sergey]

Yes, Andy and I have been trying to have a civilized debate with people on the guestbook about them stereotyping us athletes (I start WR/PR in football and Small Forward in basketball). We are here to say that all of those stories about athletes being intollerant assholes are wrong.

why are you trying to reason with that idiot sergey? all he can do is swear and go mad at people. I think he is jealous of you. Jealous that you can get girls and he cant because no woman wants a geek who just sits playing world of warcraft all day. the only emotion u should have for him is pity...

First off jackass, you CAPITALIZE my name. Did you fail school and get a GPA of 1.12 with only P.E. having anything other than a F? You are a complete jackass if you think I play World of Warcraft, you play a game where you drink semen I bet, fucked up little hill billy. Pat Tillman died, why don't you stop sitting on your ass and do what he did? Get into the army and get shot in the head cause no one likes you.

[Sergey]

But also, not ALL of them are wrong.. but many... I'm not saying that all athletes are like Andy and I, but they are not ALL intollerant assholes... out of the 100 million athletes I would guess less than 2k of them are intollerant assholes.. most of them are decent people... and then the rest are top of the class intelligent like Andy and I.

Oh... less than 2k? SCREW OFF YOU LYING SACK O' SHIT! More like 95,000,000 are are intolerant assholes. Like your forums, and SPORTS SUCK from our forums. Why don't you take turns giving one another a blow job. And, I will NOT stop with these insults.

[Earl]

Sergey, calm down, please! Why do you insist on insulting Andy and Tony? They don't deserve it. Why are you so angry? Seriously, you need to ask yourself why for your own sake. Surely you can see there's a big difference between Andy and Tony, on the one hand, and SPORTS ROCK, on the other. Can't you see the difference? Even though I'm old enough to be your dad, I'm speaking to you as a friend. Believe me, I know how you feel. (I was amused, though, when you signed off in one of your Guestbook entries as "Stalin Jr." I thought that was funny.)

Just so you will know that I'm not picking on you, if I thought that something I said to you was going to cause you to want to leave the website, I would resign as a moderator.

[Tony]

Sergey, no... not even 5k... our website.. they are not like that.. they just get a little defensive..

It really is in between 2k and 3k.. people get defensive about their opinions, and act out. You have shown that, and many Gridiron members have as well. It is very common for people, some people, have learned to avoid that (such as Earl, Andy, and I). If one side came out civilized, then the other would as well... instead.. America has turned into a place where "If you don't agree with my opinion you are un-patriotic" or "If disagree with me, I classify you as a fag!" Completely uncivilized, mostly thanks to the increasing drop out rates. It is very ignorant to pin all the bad vibes on athletes like you have done. And I don't think it is necessary to insult me so much. "Blowjob"? Why would I give a man a blowjob when I am straight? Since I am STRAIGHT, it is impossible for me to give a blowjob. You insulting me like that, makes me ignore anything you post and not give a damn about it. I still don't get why you DO insult Andy and I, when we have showed NOTHING but RESPECT for everyone on this site.... if I would have came in here (not saying I was an athlete) and said what I did say, you probably would've taken it seriously..

[Earl]

Tony, I appreciate the thoughtfulness of your remarks and the compassion you show towards others. Even if no one here seems swayed by your remarks, just remember that unregistered visitors to the forum will read them. Your good example will not go unnoticed. I don't think you and I will have any major disagreements. I've gotten tired of arguing with people at websites whom I don't even know personally, anyway.

I used to think that athletic kids never had trouble in the P.E. classes of my generation. But just recently a sociologist professor friend of mine who played football at a university from the fall of 1965 through the fall of 1968 told me that one of his high-school coaches was a sadist. The coach had been bullying him for a long time, until my friend finally lost his temper one day and punched the coach in the nose. The coach apparently had deliberately been provoking him to lash back, because he retaliated by beating my friend up. I had thought that all football players had an easy time in P.E.

[Sergey]

Sergey, calm down, please! Why do you insist on insulting Andy and Tony? They don't deserve it. Why are you so angry? Seriously, you need to ask yourself why for your own sake. Surely you can see there's a big difference between Andy and Tony, on the one hand, and SPORTS ROCK, on the other. Can't you see the difference? Even though I'm old enough to be your dad, I'm speaking to you as a friend. Believe me, I know how you feel. (I was amused, though, when you signed off in one of your Guestbook entries as "Stalin Jr." I thought that was funny.)

Just so you will know that I'm not picking on you, if I thought that something I said to you was going to cause you to want to leave the website, I would resign as a moderator.

NO! Never will I calm down, I can say whatever I want, when I want! No way you're telling me what to do. As long as shitty racist cow shit SPORTS SUCK is here, then I will not agree. I will NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER show sympathy until that fuck is banned or killed. You understand?

[Earl]

Hey, everything's cool. I wouldn't dream of bossing you around. I'm certainly not your enemy. I'm just Earl. SPORTS ROCK is not worth getting this upset. You have my permission to flame back at him. But I still think that you need to figure out why he bothers you so much. He's just not worth it. This is for your own personal growth.

Wait a minute. How is he a racist? "... until that f--- is banned or killed." I don't believe you want anyone to be killed, even though you signed off on one of your Guestbook entries as "Stalin Jr."